Friday, January 26, 2018

MORE 40, YES, THE BEST PRICE/QUALITY!!!


Following the previous evaluation post on the More 40: 
https://interestingsailboats.blogspot.de/2018/01/more-40-best-quality-price.html and after visiting it at Dusseldorf boat show, having as guide the boat engineer (Leo Curin) I have more information suplemented by the data I got in an exchange of emails with the only journalists that had sail tested the boat, namely Vedran Rozic (whom I thank) from the Croatian sail magazine More (more means sea in Croatian). 

So, first of all the interior: "Is it good?" After having visited the More 40 I visited the also new Hanse 548 and I can tell that the quality is better on the More. Not a very innovative interior, I would even say that the materials seem better than the design, that is not bad, just a bit bland, but very practical. In fact it looks better than on the photos. 

The main design issue has to do with the portholes that  are too low (regarding the design) and too small. Also a black floor that absorbs too much light making the interior a lot less luminous than it could be. I am sure that the floor boards can be of another color. The finish of the ones on the More 55 would suit very well this interior.

Regarding those panels, the color may not be the best but it would be very dificult to beat its quality even on very expensive boats: not to lose shape or twist with time and use those boards are sandwich made having as core aluminium honeycomb!!!

 There are lots of practical interior details, the chart table can turn around and be transformed in part of a continuous bigger settee, the stove will raise from the position that you see on the photo, to protect the sides of the corian working bench from the heat. Behind the stove there is a corian panel that can be brought over the stove forming a continuous bench. 

The floor on the More 55
There is plenty of storage on cabinets and the boat can have two fridges even if the energy for that will only be possible while at the port or marina, unless one chooses to motor. The outside storage is very good, with two side lockers, and a big central locker (under the cockpit). 

I had a look at the boat structure (stainless steel frame) and it is even more impressive than the one on the 55. Kind of inspires you confidence to know that the keel is bolted to that and not to a fiberglass floor. Leo said that the guys from Swan visited the boat and were impressed. Not easy to impress those guys.

The chain locker has a decent size and can be accessed from the cockpit. I don't like the anchor stand that is on the side nor visually neither in what regards effectiveness.

 It seems that the intention was to get it out of the way of the geenaker pole that will be mounted on the other side but I really don't see the need and even if the hull is reinforced internally on the supports it is much more difficult to make it strong than it would be if it was mounted the traditional way, over a stand that would serve also as a geenaker pole (X-yacht style).

In fact, on the other side of the hull, opposed to the anchor stand there is a removable fiberglass panel that will allow a spinnaker pole to be mounted. You can see it on the movie made by "Yachting World (on the bottom). It could be justifiable, I mean the anchor stand on the side and even interesting if the spinacker pole was a retractile one, like on some Elan or J boats but it seems not to be the case. This way only if the boat is used for serious racing it will make sense, including the detachable anchor stand on the size

Everything on the deck is very well done and finished, from the teak deck (option), to the quality of the sail hardware and the big swimming platform, that closes the transom. The GFC steering wheels have a nice touch and they are associated to nicely designed pedestals with solid hand grabs on the back. The cockpit table is nice, solid, easily removable and can be stowed on one of the cockpit lockers.

The engine is a 40hp Yanmar and it has a big diesel tank (for this type of boat) with 250 liters. The standard water tankage is not so good (250 liters) but an additional tank can be mounted.
 www.schwern-yachten.de/pic/upload/MORE-40-Specification.pdf

The information I have regarding the ones that sailed the boat is in accordance with what would be expected from the design: the boat has a great performance on light winds, is stiff, was sailed on 40kt wind at 11k (without spi or geenaker) and it behaved well.

The Polar speed chart is impressive with the boat doing 5kt speed with 4kt wind, 7kt with 8kt wind and 9kt with 16kt wind. Of course these numbers refer to a light boat sailing on flat seas. On a normally loaded cruising boat the numbers will not be so good but still it will be a very fast cruising boat.

I had a look at the stability curve and it is also good, especially considering that this is a boat with considerably less freeboard than mass production main market cruisers: the AVS is almost 120º and the righting moment at 90º is about the same as it is at 30º and that means a lot of RM. It is never too much to emphasize the importance of having a lot of RM at 90º since it means a rapid recovery from a knock down.The inverted stability is about half of the positive stability.

So, is this the best boat regarding price quality? I know a lot of them and I am not seeing anything that can compare, except the bigger brother, the 55. If I had to nominate another I would say the Maxi 1200, not better built, with less sail hardware, a slower boat (even if a fast cruiser)  but with a superior quality interior. It should cost about 50 to 70 000 euros more than the More 40.

Don't miss the "Yachting World" movie made on the boat show that shows many of the things I talk about on the post:  https://www.facebook.com/yachtingworldmagazine/videos/1608977529185513/


8 comments:

  1. No doubt looks a great boat. In the pdf with the specifications you are linking it shows a (standard) draft of 1.98 while in their website (More-boats.hr) they talk about 2.38 m. draft. So are there many options regarding the keel? Also the layout configuration info in their website is a bit odd to say the least (4 cabins with 4 toilettes?).

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    1. LOL. I did not have seen that. I only know about two layouts one with two heads and three cabins and another with one head and three cabins plus a separated chart table.

      The one I posted photos is the one with two heads, the standard version.

      Regarding standard draft they say on the shipyard information that it is 2.38m but obviously other drafts can be offered.

      I posted that PDF(not the information on the shipyard site) because it is very clear about the way the boat is built. That specification list is probably from one dealer (Germany?) that want the boat with those specifications in what regards draft.

      You can see that the boat on the PDF displaces 7400kg instead of 7000. Probably those 400 kg represents the difference in ballast needed to compensate the difference in draft.

      I know that the ballast that is indicated on the PDF is only 60kg more but I don't believe on that number. I believe more in the difference in displacement to correspond to the difference on the ballast.

      Here is the shipyard information: http://more-boats.hr/yachts/more-40/

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    2. Better information here: http://www.yachtworld.fr/bateaux/2018/More-40-3152123/#.WmulMa6o-01

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  2. Paulo, nice post as usual. I've read your past posts on these boats (MORE 40 and 55) and I've got a couple of questions for you (I'm looking at the 55 model):
    - Did you confirm if the hull is actually cored?
    - What are your thoughts now (having seen the boats better) on the lost rudder during ARC?
    - On the 55 you can have the main traveler both inside the cockpit OR on deck. Do you think that the on-deck position (very nice with family) is "usable"?
    - Do you know how many boats they have actually built so far?
    Thanks for your comments.
    Fabio

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  3. Hi Fabio,

    The first time I saw the boat in Dusseldorf, last year, to my surprise when I asked what was the hull core nobody new and it was a confusion. Finally they said (all of them) that the boat had a monolithic hull, saying that they did not have understood the question. I found that very odd and that boat lowered a lot on my consideration.

    Then I talked with Leo Curin about the new Bavaria C line (he is the one that designed the Bavaria's boat structure) and, as I knew he had also designed the More 55 structure (also production manager), I asked him about that, why the hell he had a boat of that size and weight had a monolithic hull?

    He has very surprised since the hull is cored. He even sent me photos of different stages of hull construction to show, without doubt, that the boat was cored.

    It happened that all the guys on the stand (that year) where guys from the charter business that did not know anything about how the boat was built!!!

    Here you have a very detailed boat specification: http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2018/More-55-3095107/Split/Croatia#.Wm36aKhl9hE

    Last time I heard about that they had made 18 boats, many of then extensively used on the Med and Caribbean, several having crossed the Atlantic two times. The intensive use in charter, from the ones that build the boat, is a great advantage because that way they can have fast and direct information regarding problems and modify the boats accordingly.

    Regarding what Leo said to me that rudder accident was an isolated problem and had probably to do with a damaged rudder for having hit rocks.

    That boat, as many of More 55 made, was used in charter and it has a single very deep rudder that can work very well, in what regards performance, but need a lot of care when mooring on the med in the traditionally way. In many cases there are plenty water (deep) at 3 or 4 meters of the quay but the bottom rises rapidly to the quay having in some times as little as 1.5m. I know because I have the same problem with my boat that has a similarly deep rudder, with 2m length. I bet the guys in charter hit the bottom a lot with the rudder. Leo, that was before a Salona production manager, told me that the More rudders where better built than on Salona and I never heard about any problems with Salona rudders.

    And they hit the bottom a lot also with the keel and I know that the boats have already three major groundings or hits, one of them at full speed, so bad that the keel was scrapped off but the boat structure did not suffer practically nothing. On the other cases no problem at all.

    A word of advise: If you are going to sail on the med don't chose the smaller draft version. On the swallow draft version the rudder will have almost the same deep as the keel. The version with a bigger draft will offer a better protection to the rudder since the keel will be significantly bigger than the rudder. Hitting the bottom slowly with the keel is not a problem, with the rudder it can be.

    The traveler over the cockpit: why would not be usable? Sure, probably it will be smaller and less effective, but the main inconvenience regards solo sailing since you will have to leave the wheel and go forward to adjust the traveler.

    If you buy one convince them to have a boat with a traditional galley. It will be much nicer. If you don't sucede I can make you some suggestions to make that interior more agreeable.

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  4. I added to the above post (on the bottom) a good movie of the More 40 made By yachting world magazine that show many of the things that I have talked about on the post.

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  5. Hi Paulo,

    Fantastic post, I need to clarify only the thing with anchor arm.
    Anchor arm is inclined due to underdeck furler and also because on PS we have retractable bowsprit that goes out for 900 mm and reaches boat center line, it slides out in direction of anchor arm, even the anchor arm is removable by only unscrewing one bolt and sliding forward.
    If you have noticed the step on fwd cabin ceiling, that is where the watertight bowsprit box is hidden, this way you can always have the bowsprit inside, completely watertight towards cabin and easily retractable from cockpit.
    Unfortunately this Swedish customer did not buy the bowsprit, it would be nice to show it...

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    1. Thanks Leo for the complementary explanations. In fact not showing that bowsprit on the boat show makes no sense at all.

      In fact it would explain why the boat has what appears to be an odd anchor stand.

      With the bowsprit out probably it will not look odd but I never saw even a design of the boat with that bowsprit. At least a design of the boat with the bowsprit should be on the shipyard site: it would make the boat more interesting specially because it is a rectratible one.

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