Thursday, January 11, 2018

MORE 40, THE BEST QUALITY PRICE?


More is an intriguing brand: the 40fter is already on the water and besides some miserably bad photos I don't hear or see anything about it, certainly not from sail magazines, nor from the shipyard. It is as if the boat was an uninteresting one or if the boatyard was not really interested in selling boats. All very odd.

I have already posted about the More 55, that is a pretty much ignored boat, with no sail tests from any of the major sail magazines even if it is amazingly inexpensive and very well built. Maybe they should start to buy advertising space on sail magazines LOL.

The shipyard story is as odd as the silence about their boats: They were and still are a Swedish -Croatian charter company specialized in performance cruising that asked Salona, the biggest Croatian sailboat builder, for the deliver of twelve 55ft performance cruisers for their business.

They didn't reach an agreement and More charter company decided to build themselves the boats. As Salona was financially in bad shape many of the workers of Salona went to work for More including top level ones, the best engineers and designers. A true transfer of technology from Salona to More.

And the boats were built, several have already crossed the Atlantic three times, since they charter in the Med and Caribbean, and it seems that the reason that they don't make advertising is because they don't need it, having their full production capacity sold out and keep receiving new orders. Weird!

Regarding financing the boat they propose, as many charter companies, to charter the boat for 6 years offering 2 weeks to the owner, the diference here are the numbers that they present that are quite incredible, maybe because they make their own boats and charter them full year, half on the Caribbean, half on the Med. Just look at this and tell me if it is not unbelievable. 

For the More 40: Price of the boat fully equipped. 200 000 euros, total return over 6 years charter - 148 000 Euros, value of the boat after six years 120 000 euros, total value of the 2 weeks free sailing over the 6 years 47 000 euros!!!!. This means that in 6 years instead of having cost you any money, it will generate you a profit of 115 000 euros, assuming you sell it.

Of course this is pretty much impossible since it gives you an interest rate of 9.5% over your money and the value of those two weeks of sailing a year having a value of 7 833 euros is exaggerated, unless it is a brand new boat and the boat will only be new on the first two years or so, then the price will be slightly lower. Probably the same happens in what regards all those numbers. But even if the numbers are just as off as the ones for the value of the two weeks, it is a very good proposition.

Assuming you keep the boat they say the cost for the owner will be at the end of 6 years 35 000 euros. Even if their values are inflated in 25% it will mean that you will have a boat free of charges for about 44 000 euros, 63 000 euros with VAT paid (in Europe), certainly much less than the value of the boat. They talk about 120 000 euros, I would say that probably 100 000 is a more realistic value for a charter boat with 6 years but even so it represents a gain of 37 000 euros.
So, it is cheap but is it good? Well, there is nothing like that on the market for the basic price of 185 000 euros (standard boat, no VAT paid). This boat has a much superior build than any mass market boat from the main shipyards. The hull is entirely cored using vacuum injection and vinylester resins and the back bone of the hull is a stainless steel grid that supports the keel and takes the efforts from the shrouds. Keel and rig efforts are that way distributed on the hull.

One of the ways you can rapidly see if a boat is built cutting some corners, in what regards boat design, is to look at the B/D numbers. Having a big ballast on a boat at the end of a deep keel increases a lot the efforts on the hull and a more expensive and strong hull and structure is needed. That extra power for more B/D will give the stability needed for more sail area and again  a stronger structure and hull will be needed for taking all those extra sail efforts and distribute them by the boat structure.

Normally main market 40ft mass production boats have, with a similar type of keel, a B/D of about 30% with a draft between 2.0 and 2.1m. The exception is the Hanse that has a good B/D of 32.5%. The More 40 has a 34.9% B/D not with a 2.0 draft but with a 2.35m draft. That will correspond to a much bigger B/D ratio, probably around 39% for a 2.0 m keel. That should be the B/D of a More with a 2.0m draft to have a similar RM of one with 2.35m draft.

Only this makes the More 40 a different boat. The superior B/D will make it not only a more powerful boat but also one with a better reserve (or safety) stability and one with a better AVS. But that is not the only diference because the boat is lighter and as strong (or more) due to the use of a completely cored hull and the use of vacuum infusion techniques and vinylester resins. The More 40 displaces 7000kg and it is about 400kg lighter than a Jeanneau SO 409 and 1800kg lighter than the Hanse 418.

Even if lighter, the More 40 can carry upwind  95m2 of sail while the heavier Hanse 418 can carry 87m2 (both boats with a jib). That will give an idea between the performance of the two boats that will be even bigger (upwind) if we consider that the More has a beam of 4.0m while the Hanse has 4.17m and less finer entries.

Another difference has to do with the number of winches, 6 on the More, 4 on the Hanse. Also in what regards travellers, the Hanse has one for the forward jib the More has one for main sail, near the wheel. More easiness on the Hanse (if one uses a small jib) and better sail control on the More. 

Regarding the Hanse it should be said that a genoa cannot be used or not be used conveniently, because the boat does not have a genoa car so a genoa cannot be conveniently reefed. This is important because while the much lighter More will have no trouble sailing in light winds with the optional genoa, that can be reefed, the Hanse will need a more expensive and less practical code 0.

The boat design is very similar to the one of the Salona 380, just a bit bigger, designed by the same naval architect,  the Italian Maurizio Cossutti that is also the designer of the new C line of Bavaria. It has  a very nice hull, one that will not only perform well while cruising but that will probably allow some good results on handicap racing.

I saw only one very bad photo of the interior that I will not post (too bad). The interior looked simple and funcional but regarding quality I can say nothing except that the one on the bigger boat is good even if the design is a bit uninspired. This will be one of the boats I will be more curious about on the Dusseldorf boat show. More information and maybe some photos of the interior after the boat show.

About the more 55: http://interestingsailboats.blogspot.pt/2017/02/more-55-more-40-too-good-to-be-true.html

4 comments:

  1. Secondhand 40 ft charterboat, 6 years old, market value 80 K. Often you see asking price of 90 to 110, higher is idiotic. Just helped a guy buy one.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The asking price, if you look at the net regarding the cheapest boats, are about 90 to 100 but I don't believe you can buy it for much less than that if the boat is in good conditions, new sails with the interior in good shape. Charter companies put the boats at the right price to be sold rapidly.

      Those used prices are inside the 25% I talked about regarding More numbers being off. It is still a very good business and you get 2 weeks free charter every year.

      Delete
  2. With 40 ft it should be possible realizing: Dedicated Shower, dedicated Navigation table.
    Knut

    ReplyDelete
  3. Informative and interesting Blog! Beautifully written, as usual, I like the post. Thank you so much for nice sharing with us. Keep posting! Charter Boat

    ReplyDelete