I had already made that comparison on the old thread but the Swedes from Hamnen did not only the same, reached the same conclusion as they had made a fantastic video with both boats on the water. :-)
Before seeing the video some basic information about the boats:
The Arpege was on the origin of Dufour success as a brand. It was designed by Michel Dufour himself and built from 1966 to 1976. 1500 boats were made and that was just huge for that time and 10 years of production. It was incredibly modern for its time, featuring a deep bulbed keel.
Built as a cruiser son revealed that it was also a competitive racer and even today is far from a slow boat. The boat was light with only 3300 kg which 1200kg of ballast on a bulb with 1.62m of draft. It was narrow (3.00m), it had 9.14m of LOA but a LWL of only 6.71m. It had 35.5m2 of upwind sail area.
The Dufour 310GL is a great design from Umberto Felci, it weights 4940kg, it has 1300kg of ballast on a torpedo keel with a draft of 1.90m. Compared with the Arpege it is beamy (3.31m) but most of all has all beam brought back and a two rudder setup. The LOA is 9.67m (LH 9.35) and a much bigger waterline (8.70m). It has 50.3m2 of upwind sail area.
Two very different designs, both great to their own epoch. As all modern boats regarding their older comparable models the Dufour 310GL has an overall better performance and an incomparably bigger interior volume.
Regarding the performance the two conditions were the Arpege would have a closer performance would be in very light wind or close upwind. On the video, besides being able to see the differences between the two interiors we can see the comparative performance close upwind with medium light wind, with the 310 being faster.
A pity they had not showed the comparative performance on other points of sail where the 310 would be much faster.
The video, as usually is very funny and as I don't understand Swede I can only see what was going on. If someone understands Swede I would be grateful for one or two meaningful comments regarding what was said.
Hi there! :)
ReplyDeleteIm spanish, but living in Norway, so I understand a little bit of swedish.
Quite funny video, comparing the 50 year old Dufour Arpege 30 with the newest (Dufour) model 310 Grand Large, lots of swearing and that stuff, but all in all, it all depends on what you need/want!... both sailboats will take you wherever you want!
Of course the 310 Grand Large, offers an interior that is more spacious with lots of light, modern looking, etc.. the exterior also spacious and doble steering wheel is great!, the boat is faster and easier to manoeuvre / sail.
Some "funny" quotes... The Joy of sailing isn't how fast you go, but in fact how slow you go! ;) (this may be true to some, so the extra speed isn't needed?).. ;) then he also comments on the "shower" on the 310 GL while on the Arpege it doesn't exist.. but hey!.. he says, showering is something you do on land anyways! :P (now, I dont know where you would find showers all around the world on land, so for me, personally, I like that from the newest) ;)
When the one who was sailing the 310, got asked if he would by the Dufour 310 GL, he looked kind of strangely... so Im not sure if thats was good.. My way of interpreting that smile would be: you crazy?.. I would never! but wonder what he means with it.. cause it seems they like it! and they said also it was the biggest 30 ft sailboat ever!, but again.. maybe the guy likes even more big and luxurious boats? who knows?
at the end.. (in fact a bit after the screen going to black), he shows a belt system, that in fact was invented by his father!.. that served to strap you when you were sleeping.. so you wouldn't roll over and fall, thats why at the very end he said.. "Bondage"... because of the "strapping in bed" idea he must have got, when talking about it! :P
personally... I would love to buy the new Dufour 310 Grand Large for my first ever sailboat!.. and sail around the world in a year or two.. with lots of stops and land adventures. Though, economy dont think would let me!.. so I may end getting an older one.. unsure what brand/model yet.. but something between 27 and 35. (in other thought.. who knows!, maybe getting a loan and buying the 310, could be seen as an invest?, it is after all a small apartment!.. and for that, its quite cheap!) ;) will see.. what I endup getting. :)
Thanks for your blog.. as I found this video searching for videos on the 310! ;)
pd. my website is in under construction.. so no... thats not me in the photo (with the yellow jacket).. but if any other color.. it might be me :P (depending if/when someone watch my site) :P
Hi Beni, welcome aboard.:-)
ReplyDeleteGreat contribution for a first comment!!!
Yes I noticed that joke about "would you buy it?" but for what I understood the question was made to someone that is a racer so this would not be at all the type of boat he would be interested in.
I saw the boat in Dusseldorf and it is in fact an amazing boat for the size, a boat for a small family and in that regard dificult to beat but in what concerns personal taste (mine) I would buy an Elan 320 instead. I am not a racer but I know I would deeply enjoy the extra sportiness of the Elan.
Regarding sailing around the world on a small sailboat I would say that the Dufour 310 would not be the best choice. For that you need all the extra stability you can get. Regarding that look at boats like the Pogo 30, the Django, the Malango, RM or if the money is a problem buy something like an used small Dehler.
All the best!
I think the Arpege has circumnavigated, but I don;t think I'd try that in the 310. The beam and lesser ballast works against you if a wave rolls you.
ReplyDeleteThe Arpege is so outdated, even the planshape is ancient. Still, there's something about the Arpege I like. Though also it is maybe a bachelor's boat, and for a bachelor planning to be celibate while at sea. All you can bring is your shaving kit... and some wine and brie. But you have the sea.
I guess a bachelor could be a woman as well
I owned an Arpege for almost 12 years and circumnavigated it with a lot of high-latitude sailing. It was a great sea boat. It was incredibly good in very light winds (to the point of being dangerous to compete with) and also very good upwind in heavy weather.
ReplyDeleteIt didn't have a very high top speed (around 6.3 knots most of the time), but it got there quite easily. I once sailed it non-stop from northern British Columbia, Canada, to New Zealand, 6600NM in 55 days. Until hitting variables north of NZ, I had averaged 140NM/day.
When it comes to stability... waves don't roll you unless you let them in the first place. Trust me, any 30-footer is derisively easy to roll, mast down to the horizontal, if you are foolish enough to keep the sea on the beam and a snarly one comes by. The boat is never going to take care of you if you don't do your part, no matter how big.
Do you have any sailing videos? Would like to hear more about your adventures in the Argege
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