It seemed too good to be true, but the fact is that the boat is on the water and certified as Class A. That does not make it properly a bluewater boat but gives you the assurance the sailboat has passed the stability requirements that are needed for that certification, and they are, for a small sailboat, so high, that very few sailboats this size are able to have them.
It is even more difficult when the beam is limited due to the need for road transport in a trailer. Sailing this boat you will know you are sailing in an extraordinarily seaworthy boat for its size.
To my knowledge, this is the only class A that is trailerable and to understand how that is difficult to achieve it suffices to say that the bigger Oceanis 30.1 is only certified as class B, and can only dream to achieve the seaworthiness and safety stability of the smaller S8 (26.3ft).
There is a reason for the Oceanis to be a Class B, and that reason is money: to have considerable more B/D in a sailboat is expensive due to the need for bigger hull reinforcements and bigger hull structure as well as the need of using superior quality materials, for assuring that the superior B/D does not translate also in an increase of the boat displacement, and therefore in a lower performance with lighter winds.
The S8 is proposed in two different versions, the DS8 and the CS8, a daysailer and a cruising yacht, having the same hull (immersed part), keels, but a different cabin, one more voluminous, offering the space for a good cruising interior, and a sleeker and lighter one. The less voluminous interior makes the S8 look absolutely gorgeous.
Both versions can be offered certified in Class A or Class B, depending on different keels, with more or less ballast, more or less draft. This has not only influence in what regards the boat stability, price, but also in what regards the easiness in putting the boat in and out of the water and in the trailer, but contrary to the First 27 all versions are easily trailerable. On the First 27 that only happens with the considerably more expensive version with a swing keel, which was the original one on the Seascape, but now is a marginal one, due to price.
This performance, particularly the upwind performance, looked too good to be true, and many doubted that the S8 could be so fast upwind, but the doubts disappeared when the DS8 was tested by Nacho Braquehais, a top Spanish sail racer (Americas's cup, TP52), that said that the overall performance was similar, if not better, than the one of a J70, and that upwind the performance was no doubt better!
On the boat structure, and bulkheads, marine plywood is used, and bonded with epoxy, and laminated to the hull and deck. The deck is made using vacuum infusion in an epoxy glass sandwich that has closed-cell PVC foam as a core. All furniture is included in the boat structure and in the end hull, deck, bulkheads, and furniture end up forming a monoblock, giving a great rigidity to the yacht.
The S8 hull is 7.95m long, 2.49 wide and can have three different keels: a swing not bulbed one with 420kg ballast, with 0.50/2.00m draft and two torpedo lifting ones, with 350kg and 570kg ballast, for 0,5/1.75m draft and 0.5/1.95m draft.
Regarding the type of engine choice, it depends: If some racing was on the program, I would ask Axel to do me a version with outboard engine on a well, similar to the one that is offered in the First 27 (Seascape 27). I believe that there is space for a 10 to 20hp outboard with electric start, and that would be more than enough, saving about 200 kg in the boat displacement (that in a 1500kg sailboat is a lot), not to mention that it would be less expensive, not only the engine, but the maintenance and even an eventual replacement.
If I was not interested in racing, or in taking from the boat all the speed I could get, I would have the 15hp inboard engine that provides better reliability and a bigger battery charge when running, at the cost of a bigger price and considerably more weight. The difference in speed the lighter boat will gain would be very little upwind, more noticeable downwind, in what regards the wind speed needed for the boat to plan, and some difference in what regards light wind sailing.
Who, will be interested in this sailboat? Well, for sure a younger version of me LOL, this boat is the answer for young sportive sailors that have a small family, like to cruise fast in a seaworthy sailboat, with a nice cozy interior, that are still working, have not much time and want to save money, keeping the boat in a garage, not paying an expensive marina berth.
This boat, like the other Sarch, has systems to lower the mast and to raise the keel that makes it relatively easy for two to put it on the water, or from the water in a dedicated trailer, which is also offered by the manufacturer.
Of course, high tech and high performance come with a high price and even if I don´t find it high for what is offered, this boat is a bit more expensive than a First 27, even considering the one with the swing keel, the only one that is easily trailerable and comparable. They say the model with a fixed keel is trailerable too but you would need a crane, and will have to tow it very carefully due to the high CG.
From what I could understand a F27 SE with a swing keel costs about 85,000 € without an engine and with dracon sails. That compares to 86,560€ for a DS8, also Class B, but with much better quality 3D Nordac North Sails and an 8hp outboard. Both prices are without VAT.
They offer two dedicated trailers with 4 wheels, both with brakes and a winch, one is able to carry 1350kg, the other 1500kg, for respectively, 4240€, and 4650€. This allows Europeans to pick a Sarch directly at the shipyard, without transport costs. The shipyard is in Spain, near Alicante.
Aeolos P30 comes also in class A version if needed I think. And is also trailable.
ReplyDeleteAeolos 30 cannot be trailed in a normal trailer due to excessive beam. Like many other boats it can be trailed if a special and much more expensive tilting trailer is used.
DeleteThey propose one of those but I cannot find information about the price. I would say that it is at least 2 times more expensive, if not more.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvFmst5Fp7E
Hi Paulo, I am also a yachtsman(66) living and sailing only in two with my wife(66) during the season 6 months in the Adriatic and also in the Mediterranean.So far I had to rent a boat (Sun Fast 26, Elan 31) but in a short time I will be the proud owner of an OC 30.1 with a yearly mooring in Marina Korkyra in Vela Luka.
ReplyDeleteI have been carefully reading and studying your articles for a few months now and I am very happy that you are giving great information about sailboats that cannot be found elsewhere.
I am sending you a link to the price list for the Beneteau First 27 and 27SE:
https://www.bootscenterkeser.de/beneteau-segelboote/721-first-21.html
http://www.bootscenterkeser.de/media/com_form2content/documents/c1/a421/f29/FIRST_27.pdf
Mast- und Schotbruch
Jan
Thanks for the information, even if the prices are more than a year old.
DeleteAs you can see it is very misleading information. They give you 78.302 euros for the boat with the swing keel.....but contrary to the one that costs 77.213€ it has no interior engine, that is only a 9CV one while on the Sarch (for the same weight) is a 15cv one.
No sails either. Only the sails (more or less de same quality in the Sarch) cost 7230 euros, the engine probably about 15 000 euros and the boat comes naked, so you pay for the electric system plus for all interior that comes standard in the Sarch, that it is anyway of much better quality and more adapted to cruising.
In the end the difference will be much less than what the advertised price makes suppose. It pisses me, this kind of stunts.
The prices on the Sarch are sail away prices, while the ones on the First 27 are not.
The boat sounds interesting, but to make the cockpit so open there's no place to sit aft, the helmsman has only a few inches to place his butt. And the bowsprit looks kind of fragile. Good try, keep on working on it.
ReplyDeleteThey have a retractable pole on the daysailer. Probably they can mount it on the cruiser, at the cost of some intrusion in the front cabin, but you have to weigh the advantages and disadvantages and obviously they thought that, in this case, the disadvantages, in what regards a worse interior space were heavier than to have a better performance bowsprit.
DeleteThe bowsprit in the cruising version looks fragile but it is all in carbon, well designed with a good distribution of forces and they have been using it for years on the smaller boat (S6 and S7) without problems.
Regarding seating, this is a sportive small boat and on sportive small boats you make your weight useful, and seat on the sides. Besides in a boat design there are a lot of compromises, and if they had made made the seating space bigger (on the back of the boat) it would not possible the great solution of having three big cockpit lookers, or two, if an inboard engine is mounted on the central one, and In a small cruising boat storage space is hard to get, and indispensable while cruising. Again you have to choose compromises.
Regarding you finding this is a sailboat with a lot f short comings, and that they should keep trying, well, the French that are quite demanding in what regards small sailboats, have found the S7 , that except to be Class A is very identical but smaller, "almost perfect" and the French have a tradition of not saying very well about non-French boats.
The general opinion in the European Nautical press about these boats is quite high, even if they are pointed to a small niche of sailors: the ones that like small, fast and seaworthy, well built (and therefore expensive) pocket cruisers.
https://www.sarch.eu/sarch-mag/
The L30 has a deep keel option that gets it up to Class A.
ReplyDeleteIt is not enough to say that the boat has the stability to be a Class A, it is needed to be certified as a Class A to be a Class A. That would be an important publicity argument, so, why the information is not available anywhere?
ReplyDeleteBesides the L30 is a one class racer and that means that all boats have the same specification, so, why a keel option that will put it out of the class?
If you have a link to that information please post it on the comments.
You are right. It is recent (this year) and I had not heard about it. With a 2.20m keel the L30 was certified as Class A. But the boat with that configuration is out of the One Class (that is Class B) and will not be able to race in class races, only in ORC/IRC races.
Deletehttps://scontent.flis4-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.6435-9/181415939_2647853492187042_1807323579274791561_n.jpg?_nc_cat=111&ccb=1-5&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=km3mdr0k2S4AX8qJZX9&tn=_iYVGiD2GaYEcPyq&_nc_ht=scontent.flis4-1.fna&oh=660e6fbd71835a3421b5867aa592c9c7&oe=61D97B35