Dusseldorf boat show, the biggest on the planet for sailboats, was killed by Covid and it did not happen for two long years in a row and its survival as main boat show was questioned by many because Covid is stronger in winter, and Dusseldorf boat show takes place in late January, while many other major sailboat shows take place in the fall or summer, and brands had reoriented their promotional exhibits to those shows.
First 36
And when two major brands (group Hanse and X-yachts) announced that they would not be there, I feared for the worst. In fact this edition posed a risk because for a brand, the participation on a show like this, with several yachts involved, implies that they take the decision many months before, and then nobody knew what the conditions in winter would be, in what regards Covid, in Germany, what would be the travel restrictions and even the restrictions that could be imposed to the ones that were visiting the boat show, in what regards social distancing, use of mask.
First 36
And we all know that, when there is a need for it, the German authorities are pro-active in legislating, and are quite strict about enforcing the law.
But the ones that were afraid lost the bet, and the many that came won: no flight restrictions, nor mandatory use of masks (only in public transports), in fact I was quite surprised because I was expecting masks to be mandatory in the boat show, and thought that visitors allowed inside the boats at the same time would be less than in previous years, but no, nothing of that, and nobody is using masks on the boat show.
First 36
And in what regards sailboats on the boat show, maybe there are slightly less bigger boats but there are probably more smaller sailboats exposed, and the two big pavilions that are normally reserved for sailboats were full.
Anyway I would have come to Dusseldorf, even if the "Messe" was smaller this year because I was really missing the annual beer "treatment". I love the city, and most of all its breweries and nice people.
Dusseldorf, and some smaller cities around, have a distinct bear that they call Alt (old in German) because they still make them by the same process it was used in medieval times. It is brewed on the spot and served as fresh as possible, in fact in some breweries you can hear the wooden barrels being rolled from the brewery to the bar.
On top Pogo 36, above J112e
The number of old breweries is big for a town of 650 000 inhabitants and they are always full and not mainly with tourists but with locals. Maybe this kind of socialization makes for the warmer character of the inhabitants face to the ones of other German cities, where people go to bed earlier. Here breweries are open till midnight and one of them till 1.00 in the morning.
First boat I visited was the First 36. I was accompanied by a friend that was particularly interested in that boat. I was very curious to see if what I had written regarding the boat, just looking at pictures and dimensions, was confirmed by a visit, namely the size of the head that seemed on the drawings incredibly small to me.
Pogo 36
And yes, the head is really bad, not only due to size but for having a foldable washbasin, something that would be acceptable in a 28/30ft boat, but completely inadequate to a 36ft performance cruiser and that diminishes in much the First 36 cruising potential, specially in what regards family cruising.
The boat interior looks good, it is functional, comfortable and nice, for a fast race-cruiser and that just turns more incongruous the choice of having that ridiculous head, just for having a 3 cabin as the only layout. Who needs 3 cabins with that head?
J112e
It is so amateurish a choice that it is hard to understand as a big firm like Beneteau went for it. With 2 cabins and a space for sail storage and cruising stuff, it would be possible to make a boat with a good head.
Anyway while cruising or racing, one of the cabins has to be occupied, either with cruising stuff or with racing sails, because there is not enough storage outside for that, so why a 3 cabin layout at the cost of a decent head?
First 36
Overall the First 36 looks nice, and very beamy, but not properly innovative. In what regards that, light years away from the innovation that the First 27 brought to sailboat design, when it was designed 12 years ago (then named Seascape 27). I still think that the designer of the two boats, Sam Manuard (First 36 in collaboration with others) was conditioned in the design, and that Beneteau would have done far better letting him do freely what he does best: designing innovative sailboats, racers or cruisers.
Pogo 36 Below, J112e
For knowing more about the boat in what regards design and performance, as well suitability for different types of races, look here:
One of the most, if not the most interesting things in the Beneteau stand was the opportunity to know Lars Reisberg, the one that was going to show the First 36 to my friend.
Lars is the author of my favorite boat blog, full of interesting stuff, and very interesting interviews. It was nice to know that he knows my blog and that he truly appreciates it. If you don't know Lars' blog, here it is a link to it:
After seeing the First 36 we visited part of the competition, the J112e and the Pogo 36, both in the boat show. These two boats, plus the performance cruising version of the JPK 10.80, are the closest competitors. They are the other 36ft fast sailingboats that offer a comfortable and suitable interior for cruising.
The Pogo 36, has almost the same HL (10.86 to 11.00m) and it is an even beamier boat (4.0 to 3.8m). I believe that while racing, overall, the First will be faster (in real time), with a better performance upwind, and will have a better ratting for IRC/ORC, but downwind the Pogo is probably faster (it is lighter - 3800 kg to 4800) and overall easier to be sailed fast, by a less experienced sailor.
Pogo 36
The Pogo interior is more radical, meaning out of the usual, than the one of the First 36, maybe not as well finished, but functional, full of light and offering an all around outside view from the interior while sailing, allowing to do a watch without going outside.
It has much more storage space, namely in what refers cabinets, offering a decent head that has the disadvantage of being inside the front cabin, taking privacy to the ones that are using the cabin, and that is not the case in the First 36.
But on the First the head is so tiny that if you are big you won't be able to close the door, seated in the bowl. Taking a shower in that space should not be easy, not to mention the foldable washbasin, that you have to rise to use the toilet bowl. More about the Pogo 36:
The J112e looks like a jboat, elegant for the ones that like that kind of more classical hulls, with the beam not all pulled back. Curiously the J112e is beamier than it looks, and if it looks narrow compared to the First 36 and Pogo 36 is not because it is a narrow boat, but because the other two are very beamy boats, with all beam pulled aft.
If compared to the Sunfast 3600 many would be surprised to learn that the Jeanneau has less beam than the Sunfast (3.55 to 3.60) and that the JPK 10.80 is very close, even if beamier (3.65 to 3.60).
J112e
The 112e has a very nice, I would say, classy interior, even if the choice of colors (or even finish) of the one that was at the boat show was not the nicest I have seen. The interior finish is very good.
It has about the same cabinet storage as the First 36, but an incomparably better head, and this one offering all privacy, not intruding with any cabin or even the saloon.
J112e
It offers only two cabins, but contrary to the other two offers a truly dedicated and very functional big storage space, that can be accessed by the outside or by the inside (through the head), and because a storage space will be needed for racing (sails) or cruising it has by far, from the three, the layout that is better suited for both activities.
Compared to the First 36, it is a slightly heavier boat (5125 to 4800kg) being that difference in weight due mostly to a bigger ballast needed because it has less draft (2.10 to 2.25) and a less effective L keel. I believe this solution is taken not because the boat is not well designed but to give it the better ratio/performance, and in fact from the three this is by far the best boat in IRC/ORC racing, with many victories in major races.
First 36
Yes, I know many would say that the Pogo 36 and the First 36 would be faster in real time and in some conditions, I am sure that is true, but almost all would misjudge the J112e comparative performance.
I would say that overall a Pogo 36 is slower than a JPK 10.80 (even if in some conditions it can be faster), and regarding the First 36, even if there is not yet data to really know for sure, I would say the overall performance should be close, with different strong points. Probably the JPK 10.80 is better for racing due to a better rating, but that is another story.
Pogo 36
And a J112e is slower than a JPK 10.80, right? Well I thought that was the case, even if not by much, but then in the 2018 Spi-Ouest, being both boats raced by top teams, it was not the case. A surprisingly fast boat, the J112e:
"In the final analysis of the leading IRC boats, some fascinating facts emerge. For those four races, the J/112E beat the winning First 40.7 (with pro's and sailmakers driving) by an average of 1:56 elapsed and by 1:36 on corrected.
J112e
And, versus the JPK 10.80 Dream Pearls (a famous Fastnet Race winner), the J/112E beat them by an average 1:29 elapsed and 1:14 corrected. Perhaps even more fascinating, the brand new JPK 11.80 sailed in IRC 1 Class by owner Gery Trentesaux ("Mr JPK" and Fastnet Race/ RORC winner) and professional skipper Jimmy Pahun and a fully pro'd up crew, got beaten by the J/112E "sport cruiser" by an average 2:04 corrected on the same race track! In fact, the 11.80 (a bare-bones, semi-custom, IRC-optimized racing boat) could barely muster a 2:30 elapsed time over the J/112E family sport cruiser. Amazing."
Boat building quality and building techniques are similar on the three boats, using vacuum infusion, a cored hull (foam in the Pogo and First, balsa on the Jboat) polyester resins with an outer layer of vinylester, cored bulkheads. Regarding the way the structure and bulkheads are fixed to the hull, Beneteau and Pogo don't mention it (I assume they are bonded) on Jboats say that besides being bonded all intermediate bulkheads are also glassed to the hull and deck.
Pogo 36 cockpit
Both Pogo and First use deck steeped masts while the Jboat uses a keel steeped mast. Both systems are safe, but keel steeped masts offer additional resistance, with the disadvantage of being difficult to prevent a small entrance of water, even if there are systems that can manage that.
Last but not the least, the price, and it is with surprise that I find out that the First 36 is the more expensive at 234 130 euros, followed by the 112e that costs 222 270 euros, being the less expensive the Pogo 36 at 201 000 euros (with a fixed keel). A swing keel version costs 5000 euros more. Prices for standard boats at the shipyard without taxes.
J112e cockpit, This boat has not a fixed cockpit table option , but it has an option for a collapsible table mounted on the side, on a rail
With an European 20% VAT and equipped, ready to sail swing keel Pogo 36 will end up costing over 300 000 euros. The others should not come cheaper, but because the equipment prices for different boats can be different, to really know and compare prices, you need to have them with the same equipment.
By the way, the First 36 has won the 2023 European award for the best performance cruiser beating the Elan E6, the Grand Soleil 40, the Italia 12.98 and the Solaris 50. The result was announced at Dusseldorf. I don't understand how such a flawed 36ft cruiser (by the inadequacy of its head for cruising) can have won the award, even if they loved the way it sails.
They are choosing a performance CRUISER, and no matter how good it sails, the cruising ability is the main attribute and if one side of the equation is so inadequate as it is the case in the First 36, how is it possible to consider it better than other boats, where excellent performance meets great cruising potential, as it is for example the case with the Italia 12.98?
The last post of the season, I mean, the armchair sailing season 😀. Before the end of the month, I will fly to the south of Italy to start the sailing season, and for some months I will have too much fun for having time to continue with the blog.
The last post is for the First 36 because the initial impression I have about the boat has changed a bit. I confess I was a bit pissed with the First 36 lack of ambition and with the price but the truth is that the boat, without looking innovative, looks better than in the drawings. The interior looks incomparably nicer in the photos.
I don't know why they have made such bad work with the drawings, and such good work with the photos, but it is better to do good work with the real thing than with the drawings. Have a look at a previous article about the First 36 with some comparisons with the competition:
I have not seen the boat yet, but I have seen photos, two boat tests and a video and the First 36 looks definitively better now. The saloon and the cabins look comfortable enough to make life enjoyable while cruising on the fast lane.
Unfortunately, the head is as bad as I thought it was, and having an unpractical foldable washing basin on a boat with these dimensions, a boat that will be more used for cruising than for racing, does not make sense. It would be way better if they had opted for a two-cabin layout (instead of a three-cabin one), with one of the aft cabins transformed into storage space, using the rest of the space for a "normal" head.
And I say it would be used more for cruising than for racing because now, having a better look at the hull design, it is clear that this boat is not going to be competitive in IRC or ORC, being too much downwind maximized, and even in downwind races, like the Transquadra, I don't believe it will be as competitive as the JPK or the Sunfast. Neither will it be competitive with them in races by boat length, like the Silverruder.
The First 36 would make a lot of sense if it had managed to follow the previously announced program intentions. Andraz Mihelin has stated about that: The First 36 would offer almost the same performance as a Pogo 36, for the price of a Dehler 34 (with a price lower than 150,000 euros).
It was not meant as a fast top cruiser-racer (a boat with an overall top performance) like the Sunfast or JPK, but as a very fast performance cruiser, that would offer great cruising potential and fun, for a lower price. The target was the Pogo 36.
But the lack of a decent head diminishes the First 36 cruising potential, as much as the price, which is nowhere near "less than 150 000 €", neither near the one of the Dehler, but very close to 200 000 € (198 000) and I bet that after the first boats, that price will rise, while a Pogo 36 costs 172 473 € and a Dehler 34, a bit slower but with a better cruising interior, costs 168 900 € (all prices at the shipyard without taxes).
It seems to me that they missed completely the price target (by 33%) and that will make the First 36 a boat difficult to sell. On the "Yacht.de" sail test, they said that the First 36 sailed "amazingly" but they would have said the same if they were testing the Pogo 36 (that is probably faster), and all that follow racing know that, overall, the Sunfast 3600 and the JPK 10.80 are faster than the Pogo, except in downwind races.
The First 36 costs much more than the Dehler 34, costs even more than the Pogo 36, and it is very near in price of faster and better racing boats, like the Sunfast 3600 or the JPK 10.80. It has also to compete with the J112e which, like the JPK, has a great racing record (the J112e is a bit more expensive).
First 36 head, with foldable washing basin
The JPK 10.80 has a good cruising interior, with a worse galley than the First but a better head; the J112e, being faster than the Dehler, has an excellent cruising interior (as good as the one of the Dehler) and only the Sunfast 3600 has a more naked and less comfortable cruising interior (but with a bigger and better head). You can see photos and the layout of those boats here:
We will see how the First 36 sells, but one thing is for sure, it would sell much better if they had managed to keep its price similar to the one of the Dehler 34 😉.
Since Seascape was bought by Beneteau, and their yachts were renamed First, that there are rumors and announcements of a new First, designed by Sam Manuard (the designer of Seascapes), a yacht following the design criteria of the Seascape 27, but bigger, a fast ClassA cruiser-racer.
Since the time Manuard designed the Seascape 27 his career as a designer of a fast racing yacht grew a lot in relevance, and from a top designer of mini-racers, he became gradually a top 40class and a top IMOCA designer, so, it was with great interest that the new design was awaited. But it took several years to happen, and from a 30/33ft cruiser-racer, it ended up to be a 36ft yacht.
We all expected something as innovative as the Seascape 27 was 10 years ago, but things are complicated in a big company like Beneteau, with many deciding what to design and build, and the new boat, that after all was not designed only by him, ended up being quite a disappointment, for those that waited for a very innovative yacht.
In fact, the boat, due to high freeboards and classic lines looks like an Oceanis or a Dufour, a deja vu design. Beneteau wanted the new boat to be so many things at the same time, that the many mixed compromises ended up producing something that looks bland and not exciting.
In Beneteau's words this yacht is about "the pursuit of the ultimate balance", being this balance not about creating a cruiser-racer able to win offshore races, inshore races, solo or duo, "but about a perfect balance.....between comfort and performance, elegance, and utility..."
The word "elegance" is a bit tricky because it normally refers to past concepts of beauty and a continuing line of development, much as "in the tradition" and makes no sense on this type of performance yacht, where words like sexy, which refer to having contemporary radical racing lines, would be much more adequate.
But "elegance" was what they tried to achieve on the First 36, and therefore it is explained the deja vu look, and I would say that in what regards elegance, it was a failed attempt, since due to high freeboards it is impossible to give it the looks of a smaller First 53, and it ended up very far from Beneteau objective, that was a "classical and timeless aesthetic". As the one responsible for the First 36 design (Lorenzo Argento) says:
" First 36 is following the same design language of her larger sister – First Yacht 53, building on the timeless aesthetic of his work on Wally and Brenta."
Of course, what counts for them is sales, and I cannot say if they are right in what regards this boat to become a big success, it all depends on how the boat sells, and for that, besides the sailing performance, the price, the looks and the interior layout are very important.
In what regards price (more expensive than an Oceanis 40.1), it seems to me too high for a sailboat that is fast, but does not look like a very fast sailboat, with no visual references to top racing, and looks more like a much less expensive mass-production yacht.
The ones that buy this type of yacht want it to be very competitive in what regards IRC/ORC racing or want the looks of the sailboat to scream FAST and INNOVATIVE (not elegant) or both.
For the ones who want first and mostly to race competitively, and also do some cruising with the boat, the First 36, does not seem to have what it
First 36, Sunfast 3600, JPK 10.80, J122e
takes to be competitive in face of the competition, namely the JPK 10.80 and the Sunfast 3600.
For the ones who want to cruise and race (50%) the J112e offers a much better interior, much more elegance, that kind of "classical and timeless aesthetic", and for sure, much better results in IRC/ORC racing.
First36
I bet that over the water the JPK 10.80 and the Sunfast 3600 will be faster, The J112e will be probably only faster in light wind and maybe upwind, but on handicap should have no problem in beating the First 36, and that is not surprising because the J112e is designed by an expert in handicap racing, and the First 36 is designed by a specialist in offshore trade-wind racing designs, without a big experience designing for IRC/ORC racing.
Maybe I am being a bit too harsh on this evaluation, but it really pisses me off that after such a long waiting time, with so great expectations regarding a sexy innovative cruiser-racer by Sam Manuard, all we got was a supposedly elegant, fast cruiser, with a "timeless aesthetic", meaning a traditional design.
Let's see how the First 36 compares with the competition in regards to dimensions and technical characteristics: The First 36 has 11.00m hull length, the JPK 10.80 has 10.80m, the Sunfast 3600 10.80m, the J112e 10.99m. The First 36 has a 3.80m beam, the JPK 10.80 has 3.65m, the Sungfast 3600 3.55m, the J112e 3.60m.
Sunfast 3600
First 36 has a 32.3%BD, a torpedo keel with 2.25m draft, for a 4800kg displacement; the JPK 10.80 has 45.3%BD, a straight keel with 2.20m draft for a 4750kg displacement, the Sunfast 3600 has a 41.8%B/D, a bulbed keel with 2.13m for a 4950kg displacement; the J112e has 33.8%B/D, a bulbed keel for a 5125kg displacement, with 2.10m draft.
The First 36 has an upwind sail area of 80m2 and downwind 180m2; the JPK 10.80 has an upwind sail area of 73m2 and a downwind sail area of 160m2; the Sunfast 3600 has 69.8m2 upwind and 136.8 downwind and the J112e has 71m2 upwind and 180m2 downwind.
JPK 10.80
The First 36 is light and the beamier of the 4. Only the JPK is lighter, but regarding the JPK and the Sunfast, the First low displacement is obtained through less ballast weight (less 600kg than on the JPK, less 518kg than on the Sunfast, less 181kg than on the J112e). And this assuming they can build the First with that displacement, but even so, if we take out the extra ballast on the J112e, the First would be only 144kg lighter.
The First is the one with more sail area but also the one with more drag, especially wave drag, due to being much beamier than all the others and that means it needs more sail area to go at the same speed. It will have a very good performance downwind and it is possible that it will be as fast, or even slightly faster than the JPK and the Sunfast, in medium-strong to strong winds (and certainly easier), but it will lose to the two in all other circumstances and probably will lose for the J112e in lighter winds and upwind.
J122e
Certainly, a very nice hull (Sam Manuard) spoiled by the overall design (Lorenzo Argento), but a bit too much maximized for beam reaching and downwind sailing for being a winner in most sail races. I also doubt that the rating is going to be a good one for IRC/ORC racing.
The interior looks pretty much that of a cruiser-racer very much race-oriented, and it offers a more practical galley than the ones in theJPK and Sunfast, with a true stove. However, the JPK interior looks cozier and the J112e interior is uncomparably better and nicer, looking like the one of a good quality cruising boat.
Sunfast 3600
In the First, the worse is a truly a very small head, that they call innovative. When I visit the boat I will be very curious to see how small it really is, and where is the innovation (besides being too small).
So, just pretend that you have the money and tell me which one you would choose? knowing that regarding price the First is as expensive as the others, including the J112e, which has a much better interior finish.
It seems that the JPK and the Sunfast are slightly less expensive and that is quite surprising. But, of course, we are talking about prices at the factory and about standard boats, and on a fully equipped boat, the difference of price between any of these yachts should not be big.
Depending on the chosen equipment, more cruising, club racing, or top racing, the prices on these boats ready to sail should be between 230 and 280 000 euros, including around 20% European VAT. Expensive? Certainly regarding the amount but not regarding building costs.
JPK 10.80
That's the price of a well-built sailboat, and if they could make it for less money they would because less expensive boats sell better and the competition is strong.
The price of one of these boats is about the same price that would cost a mass production 40ft sailboat from one of the major brands, and it explains why mass production yachts are built the way they are, using polyester resins, non cored hulls, no vacuum infusion, a "contre-moule" as hull
structure, use plywood bulkheads and only bonding agents to secure all in place.
These fast cruiser-racers are built using vacuum infusion techniques (some of them in a single shoot), have cored hulls, most use only vinylester resins, have cored composite bulkheads, bonded and glassed to the hull and deck, the structure frame is glassed and bonded to the hull (and sometimes infused with it). That is why they can be light and strong. That's also why they are better sailing boats and much more expensive ones.
J112e
For the increased price it also counts bigger winches, 6 instead of 2 or 4, better and bigger sail hardware, and in what regards this the differences in price are sometimes 4 times more for same-sized and apparently similar material, but with completely different load capacity. The increased B/D of these boats also contributes to make them more expensive because that demands a stronger hull and a bigger structure to absorb bigger efforts.
You pay what you get and for many, a mass-production boat is enough for their needs, in what regards sail performance and build quality, so why pay for more that you don´t need?
For the ones who want a top sailing machine, they should know that the price would be much higher, the same way nobody expects to pay for a Dacia or a Fiat, the same one pays for an Alpine or a Lotus.
First 36
Saying that the Lotus or the Alpine are expensive, compared to a Dacia or a Fiat, makes so little sense, as saying the same comparing the price of an Oceanis 38.1 with the price of any of these fast cruiser racers.
In fact, they cost about 50% more than an Oceanis, of about the same size, and that is way less than the difference between a same-sized Fiat and a fast small sports car. For me, the problem with the First 36 is that being a sportive boat it looks like a Fiat, and who would like to have a Lotus that looked like a Fiat, even if it has good performance? OK, I am exaggerating, but you get my drift.
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